Welcome Aboard And Case Preview

SPEAKER_00 0:28

We're not here to accuse. We're here to ask any of this actually makes sense. Welcome aboard. Hey everyone, welcome to episode four of Cruise Ship Killer. I'm Jeff, and this is the incident everyone is talking about.

SPEAKER_01 0:47

And I'm Kathy.

SPEAKER_00 0:48

Hi, Kathy.

SPEAKER_01 0:49

Hi.

SPEAKER_00 0:50

So the story today is one that everyone is talking about, for sure. You and I have been talking about it a lot lately. And um for all the right reasons, right? I mean, this story has kind of captivated everybody.

SPEAKER_01 1:04

Yeah, it I haven't heard a story like this one on a like a cruise ship death like this for a while now. Right? Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:10

Yeah, and this one we don't have a CSK. No. We got somebody that could be a CSK. Anyway, so this story is um about Anna Keppner. I'm sure people out there know exactly the story we're talking about, which is the 18-year-old who went on a family six-day cruise vacation to the Caribbean, leaving out of Miami on Carnival Um Horizon, that ship. One of their flagship, I think. Isn't it one of the big ships? It's a big ship, 15 decks, I think.

SPEAKER_01 1:41

It could be. I haven't I haven't ever been on Carnival yet, but yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:44

I mean, it's it sounds like a really nice ship. And um unfortunately she didn't she didn't make it home. She ended up being found

The Timeline Of Anna Keppner

SPEAKER_00 1:53

dead. So we're gonna run through the timeline really quick so that those of you that don't know this story are brought up to speed. So on November 2nd, um, she leaves with her family on this six-night Caribbean cruise out of Miami, and she's traveling with her parents, Chris and stepmother Chantelle, uh, her grandparents, Jeff and Barbara, and then she's got her step and uh a full biological brother traveling with her. So it's got it's her, her 16-year-old stepbrother, 14-year-old biological brother, and uh nine-year-old stepsister. And so on the 6th, Anna ends up going back to her room because she's not feeling well. She I guess it was at the casino gambling with her grandmother, goes back to her cabin. And on the 7th, at breakfast, she's MIA. No one knows where she is. So there's a ship alert, right? Everybody's going looking for her. And uh later that day on the 7th, we'll come back to timing on that. Uh, her body is found wrapped in blankets and life preservation.

SPEAKER_01 3:11

Life preserves covering her.

SPEAKER_00 3:13

Under her bed in her stateroom. Correct. Um, the ship uh docks in Miami because it's on its way back on the 8th. The FBI takes control of the scene, which is really common, right? The FBI gets right on scene, they they secure the scene, and um on November 24th, a death certificate confirmed that she had died from mechanical asphyxiation caused by a bar hold, which would be pressure applied to the neck. On February 3rd, federal prosecutors in the Southern District of Florida officially charge her 16-year-old stepbrother with homicide. And he's a minor. On the 6th, he appears in federal court for the first time. And then on the 4th, which is not too far from out, what are we doing? What are we what what day is it today? The 9th, 8th? I've lost track of the date. Yeah, okay. So not long ago, like literally days ago, right? Uh new filings in family court. We'll talk about that, right? In family court revealed that uh he's officially, the stepbrother is officially not living with the mom at home anymore, living with other family members. People were speculating, so now we know officially. So, Kathy, where do we start with this one, right?

SPEAKER_01 4:37

Yeah, and um This is there's a lot in here. Yeah, a lot of uh blending of of kids um on this cruise with the half-brothers and the stepbrothers and the biological, you know, family members. Um so I I guess this was going to be their first um cruise, and they were gonna try and start a a tradition to blend this family. But I I had read that her um her dad, you know, he after his second divorce, two months after his second divorce, he he married um Anna's stepmother, and so they really kind of rushed into blending all these kids into this one big family.

SPEAKER_00 5:30

When was that in relation to when they took it? 2024. 2024, okay.

SPEAKER_01 5:35

About a year later, they're you know, they're trying to do things with the kids and I guess try to create the Brady Bunch family.

SPEAKER_00 5:45

So the cruise they left on the second. So this incident happened way into the cruise.

SPEAKER_01 5:53

The right, the night before the last night of the cruise?

SPEAKER_00 5:58

Yeah, so when she went missing was the seventh. Or reported. That's when it went out. Like we don't know where she is.

SPEAKER_01 6:04

The sixth, I think.

SPEAKER_00 6:06

Was that when they reported that her? I thought it was the seventh that they said. That's when they found her. That's when they found her. But the si the evening of the sixth is

The Last Night And Missing Details

SPEAKER_00 6:14

when she went back to her room. That was the last time everybody saw her.

SPEAKER_01 6:17

Correct.

SPEAKER_00 6:18

What happened? Do you know, on the sixth that night?

SPEAKER_01 6:22

I think she said her, you know, her braces were hurting, she wasn't feeling well, she went back to her room. Then she got dressed and showed up in the casino, like you said, with her grandparents. Then she left again, said she was going to her cabin for the night. Um, and then I think we read both brothers later were in the room, but then the 14-year-old brother left to take photos.

SPEAKER_00 6:50

Yeah, that's what that's what I my understanding is she went back. The two brothers, the stepbrother and her 14-year-old biological brother, go back to her, back to their room, because they're all sharing the room. Right? So it's the three of them in that room, parents in their room, and then the grandparents in their room. And I think the younger, the nine-year-old, was with the parents, right? So the teenagers all have this room. So they yeah, the two guys go back, and then from what I understand, the 14-year-old brother, biological brother, ended up changing, and then he ended up leaving because he wanted to go take some photographs. And he comes back, and but this is reported from an ex-boyfriend. So I I we you know, he's he's the ex-boyfriend saying this is what this 14-year-old boy said, so we don't gotta take that with a grain of salt, right?

SPEAKER_01 7:42

And it was after he after the cruise that he supposedly told the ex-boyfriend this story.

SPEAKER_00 7:48

Right, which is yeah, you you would think this would s come out somewhere. I I mean, I think that the thing that we all have to every sh everybody should know is that a lot of the incident report is all locked up behind court documents that are sealed. So we have no idea of really kind of what exactly who said what and when, right? Right. And so that's the challenge here. I think that's why everybody's talking about it, because it's speculation city. Um so uh apparently this boyfriend says he, the brother hears a commotion happening.

SPEAKER_01 8:24

Like chairs being thrown around.

SPEAKER_00 8:26

Right.

SPEAKER_01 8:27

And I think he even said he heard yelling and that he heard the stepbrother say, you know, shut the hell up.

SPEAKER_00 8:34

Right. But the bottom line is we really don't know.

SPEAKER_01 8:37

And he's locked out of the room. He can't get into the room, he said. He's locked out of the room.

SPEAKER_00 8:42

Right. So on the seventh, rolls around, breakfast, she doesn't show up. Right?

SPEAKER_01 8:54

True, but like on the sixth, the the 14-year-old, he comes back later, the room is not locked anymore, he doesn't see her in the room, but the stepbrothers are and then they just go to sleep because I don't know where he thought. Maybe he thought she went to a grandparent's room if they were arguing.

SPEAKER_00 9:12

Yeah, he did he did. He he that's what again next boyfriend's saying, he said to him, yeah, that he had gone, he he had assumed she had just gone out with the adults, had been out. That's eerie. So uh who knows? So that could have been she could have been or she's already there, probably in the room.

SPEAKER_01 9:33

Run yeah, under hidden under her bed. Hidden under her bed. He didn't know.

SPEAKER_00 9:38

Yeah, and we have no idea where the other guy was, where the stepbrother was at that point.

SPEAKER_01 9:43

Well, I think he was also sleeping in the room.

SPEAKER_00 9:45

Oh, was he really? Oh, see, I didn't know that. Yeesh. So okay, so when is she found? She and she's found she's found by a uh housekeeper.

SPEAKER_01 10:01

The next morning.

SPEAKER_00 10:02

The next morning. And the medical examiner has said sh uh, you know, time of death at 1117 a.m. I'm still scratching my head about how they can get so precise on that. It's a homework assignment, I guess. Right?

SPEAKER_01 10:17

I yeah, I still think she's she died on the sixth. And then they found her on the seventh.

SPEAKER_00 10:24

I think you're right.

SPEAKER_01 10:25

But like you said, there's so many records that are, you know, not available because the step son is a minor, so you have a lot of information that's sealed and a lot of information that's not coming out.

SPEAKER_00 10:42

Well, what we do know is that it the FBI have moved from getting on the boat to charging someone with homicide in a matter of months. That's fast.

SPEAKER_01 10:53

Well, I I thought it was slow. Why I was three months? I you know, everybody's like, oh, it he's he's been a suspect right away. Why is it taking so long to charge him with it? And then I was kind of reading about um, you know, when somebody does pass away on a cruise ship, the FBI is saying, you know, you have this floating crime scene which is challenging, and you have a small window to get evidence and to investigate before the ship leaves again for the next cruise. Right. So they're kind of under a time limit. But um I also think that um it's because you know they were trying to make sure they had evidence that would um stick to be able to charge him. Yeah. So I I I think that is why it took so long. Um they needed forensic evidence. He's a minor and they want

FBI Response And Floating Crime Scene

SPEAKER_01 11:55

to try to build an airtight case before they charged him.

SPEAKER_00 12:00

Yeah, it must be, I mean, they must have to do a lot of collecting of evidence. I know, I know that crews are they're supposed to be trained on securing crime scenes. You know, so an incident happens, it's kind of like housekeeper discovers it, it's like, okay, we lock this down. Right? So they had to have done that. So, all right. So let's get into a little bit about the the family dynamics here because immediately after this happened, the grandparents were pretty much interviewed right away. I mean, they were they were interviewed by ABC. I, you know, they so you you you saw them getting, you know, coming out and saying, you know, everybody gets along, we don't know what's going on, yada yada yada, right?

SPEAKER_01 12:48

They they did say that, you know, they're like the three amigos, you know, but she also said, you know, oh, he's had demons in the past that he's he's dealing with. Right. That was interesting.

SPEAKER_00 12:59

That was in that was really interesting. That's kind of a red flag. Yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 13:04

And I got the impression that he was already had been in therapy before this.

SPEAKER_00 13:11

I mean, it's the the the whole thing is just a horrible tragedy. The more I dug into it, the more I was like, God, this is horrible.

SPEAKER_01 13:18

And I think the big question everyone's asking is, you know, why is she in the room? Why is she in the room with the two brothers? And uh the mom, you know, the mom was asked in an interview, um, why are they old? And she said, Oh, all of them were given the option to stay in another room. And the lady was like, would that be the grandparents' room? And she said yes. They all said no, they all wanted to stay together um because they're very close, you know, and I'm like, uh all the other stories I'm reading is no, she's afraid of him. They're not, they're not very close.

SPEAKER_00 13:58

Yeah, there's a lot of conflicting things. You know, the the ex-boyfriends, there's two ex-boyfriends, and one of the ex-boyfriends' fathers come out has come forward and basically saying, Yeah, you know, Anna was always really afraid of the stepbrother, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Um, so that got me curious, you know, thinking, okay, if these, if these people are all speaking up, she had a huge funeral, right? A lot of her classmates came forward, were talking, you know, all sorts of positive things about her and this, that, and you, I would have thought for sure that some

Blended Family And Conflicting Accounts

SPEAKER_00 14:35

of her girlfriends would have come up and said, Yeah, she was always afraid of this guy. But there I didn't find anything like that. Just just these ex-boyfriends. So it was a little bit of a head scratcher to me.

SPEAKER_01 14:47

Well, yeah, and and they kept saying, Oh, you know, he he's sexually harassing her and he's creepy, and um, he's obsessed with her. Uh, and then the dad of the ex-boyfriend is saying he, you know, we went to the family, he tried to tell them they didn't believe him, the family didn't believe him, the parents. And my question was, why isn't she saying anything to the parents? And and it just kept coming up that no, she was too afraid to say anything, and that he always carries around a big knife and she's afraid he's gonna hurt her, so she apparently didn't say anything to the parents, just uh the ex-boyfriend.

SPEAKER_00 15:25

Right. That seems odd. That seems really odd. But the so the real crazy thing to me about this whole thing is that the information that all of us are getting is coming out through the family court system.

SPEAKER_01 15:39

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 15:40

Right?

SPEAKER_01 15:41

Yeah, like the whole part about him being charged wasn't even on the news. That came out because a reporter was at the custody hearing, and that's when the family's like, he's been charged with his stepsister's murder, and and so that's coming out in the custody hearing.

SPEAKER_00 16:00

Yeah, and not just murder. There's a redacted portion where it's an and murder. So there's a redaction and then and murder. So everybody on social media is going bonkers, wondering what that redacted is. And I think everybody knows what that redacted is. It has some kind of a either a sexual assault or something rape, it could be anything, any of those things that's being blocked out.

SPEAKER_01 16:27

Right, which is also confusing because they're like saying there's no alcohol, there's no drugs, there's no sexual assault. The preliminary, you know, autopsy or whatever. Yeah, yeah. But now there's a redacted chart, so something's not being said again.

SPEAKER_00 16:41

Right. There's there's a lot of holes here. There's a lot of holes here. Um yeah, getting it through the family court system is kind of interesting. Uh, you know what's what was kind of an indicator to me that clearly this family knew something was going on with this this boy was Floridatoday.com actually had put this out, I think it was in, yeah, it was at the end of December. So, you know, enough time has happened, but apparently some of the text messages um were also in some of this family court filings. So the uh mother, his mother who's on the boat, right, is texting the father and basically saying, hey, you know, this is an emergency, contact me. You know, I need you to call me as soon as possible, you know, ASAP. And then um, and she's kind of chattering back and forth with him about, you know, kind of more about the his sister who is there, right? And um you can tell the mom is trying to protect both of them, knowing it just you just kind of got this hint that she clearly knew something was up with him, you know, uh, and you know, trying to shield him in some way. But that was pretty early on, in my view.

SPEAKER_01 18:09

It was because then I read afterward that, you know, um he was hospitalized. And the grandmother said she was in part of the interview with the police, and you know, he was saying he doesn't remember anything. Um and repeatedly he did that. Yeah, and then they interviewed a psychologist that said, What do you think? And she said, Well, uh sometimes when somebody does something um this bad, they do have memory issues, but in her opinion, she said she thought he was lying about not remembering that he's just trying to, you know, cover it up. Um so I I think that after they got off the ship, he was hospitalized, and then apparently I read the mom and Anna's dad kicked him out of the house, and he is living with his maternal uncle. Yeah. And so now the the uh father of the six 16-year-old, because of that, went back to family court and said, I'm not paying child support anymore to you. You don't even have him in your house anymore. You like kicked him out, so why am I paying child support? So he's trying to get that stopped.

SPEAKER_00 19:38

It's really bizarre.

SPEAKER_01 19:39

I I've learned that both families are just a mess. You know, I I think I think that I think I read that that guy's been married several times, married, divorced, and then Anna's dad, you know, she was married to her mom, and then he had an affair with the 15-year-old babysitter that used to watch Anna. So the mom left, moved to Oklahoma and left, and then this babysitter girl, he married her two years later. She raised Anna, and then he divorced her, and two months later married um Chantel. Wow. So that's what I'm saying. It's all nobody seems to have a I don't want to say a normal family, but you know some stability.

SPEAKER_00 20:27

Stability. I would say stability was both sides.

SPEAKER_01 20:30

It's so crazy when you read all stuff. And uh her biological mom even said, you know, nobody notified me that she died. I knew she was on the ship and someone died, and I I found out

Family Court Filings And Redactions

SPEAKER_01 20:42

it was her by Googling. And and then the dad said, You're not coming to the funeral service, or I'll have you arrested for because you owe back pay and child support. So she's like, I'm just gonna disguise myself and show up at the And she did. She did, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 20:58

Yeah, good for her.

SPEAKER_01 20:59

Yeah. But the whole both sides, so much instability. No, it's nuts. And now you have this huge blended family with all these kids, you know, that takes time and they're just trying to I think they're just trying to like rush everything, and oh, you're all the three amigos or you know, I don't know, it just doesn't add up.

SPEAKER_00 21:21

What's I mean the the real things that are just the the mystery part of this to me is uh two part. One is because of what you just said, all this kind of crazy family stuff, and this lengthy history of crazy family stuff, right? Is you try to piecemeal together what was her relationship with the 16 year old stepbrother, right?

SPEAKER_01 21:46

Right.

SPEAKER_00 21:46

You hear, you know, kind of stuff from these ex boyfriends and whatnot. But that's you know, those are people on the outside of the family, right? You you you don't the grandparents certainly didn't didn't seem to have Particular bent on their relationship, other than to say that they're, like you said, the three amigos, right? It just seemed inconsistent, right? So that's still a mystery to me, right? It's like what was that relationship? And then um and then the uh the other part is what actually happened in that room? You know? And that's that 14-year-old has it would be nice to know if he actually did say something.

SPEAKER_01 22:33

I couldn't find where he told anyone until after the fact.

SPEAKER_00 22:37

So, but if the FBI charged and they had to have evidence.

SPEAKER_01 22:42

Correct. They probably have they probably have physical evidence from the cabin.

SPEAKER_00 22:46

There has to be. Yeah. There has to be. There has to be. And and it has to be probably with something else, like the 14-year-old saying, God, there was a fight going on in there. There was something going on there. I couldn't get in. Or the 14-year-old says, That, I heard that, and I saw that, or whatever, couldn't get in. And, oh, by the way, three weeks ago, he was seen doing this, or whatever.

SPEAKER_01 23:13

Yeah, and and also I I saw that she's got these three kids in a room. It's against uh Carnival's policy. You have to have someone age 25 or older to be in the room, the cabin with these kids. Really? Yes. And she's so the whole thing probably could have been prevented. Um, but I guess that leads to the question of I know you're you're supposed to, but where I don't know how the ship would know that, right? Because you could you could have put somebody on that room that was an adult, she could have put her husband and said he's in that room and then he stays in the other cabin and then the three of them, and how would the ship know that it's three underage kids sharing a cabin?

SPEAKER_00 24:04

I didn't I didn't even think of that. Yeah, I didn't even think of that.

SPEAKER_01 24:06

So if she had if she had done that, you know, that this whole thing wouldn't I don't think what would have happened because there would have been adults in the cabin with them.

SPEAKER_00 24:19

Yeah. Well uh if the next question then for you for is he tried as an adult? Should he be tried as an adult? Because if he's tried as an adult, all of this stuff we can re can read about, right? Because all of that information will come out. If it's minor, we're not gonna know.

SPEAKER_01 24:45

I'm thinking he's not gonna get tried as an adult because if he was in therapy for whatever before all this happened, because I don't even know what demon she was talking about, um he was obvious you know, he's gonna say mental, I have mental issues and I've been in therapy. And do you do you get tried as an adult if you're a minor with mental issues and you're actively going to a therapist? So probably not.

SPEAKER_00 25:14

It's a good question. It's for a lawyer to answer. I don't I don't know.

SPEAKER_01 25:18

And the other interesting thing, you know, you were talking about how at first the m the stepmom was trying to um kind of cover for him or whatever. Yeah. I this is this interesting to me. I I read that the um the family was um

Cabin Rules Adult Trial And Online Blame

SPEAKER_01 25:41

saying they want him you know nailed to a coffin. And so I'm like, well, who who which family members? Because it's on it's on the 16-year-old side, and it's the it's the mom and Anna's uh dad who are saying they want him buried and nailed to the coffin. So they've done a complete 360 on on trying, you know, starting out as trying to protect him, and now it's like, oh, I'm kicking you out, and we hope that you are are buried.

SPEAKER_00 26:20

You know, in the tech in the text messages, when you read through this this exchange, a lot of it is let's see if I can find one here. Um uh let me see. Yes, he says, okay, I know this is on uh November 9th. Chantel texts her her ex-husband. Okay, I know everything is supposed to be hush-hush for now, but I've seen that it is still getting out with posts and comments between Facebook, TikTok, and stuff. I just want to make sure until things are certain that he doesn't get any unnecessary comments toward him. So to me, I that like screams like I'm paying attention to how this is like perceived by the outside world on social media. Right, and more than I care about anything else. It's it seems really bizarre to me.

SPEAKER_01 27:08

Yeah, social media is how all these comments are getting out about you know him also.

SPEAKER_00 27:14

And this is November 9th. I'll repeat that. November 9th. They port it went and reported November 8th. She's dead on the 7th. They said, Where is she? She's not at breakfast. She texts that at on November 9th. So yeah, talk about um, yeah, I think I think it's an understatement to say the family's a little screwy.

SPEAKER_01 27:38

Yeah, and I well, I it it's gonna be interesting to see what the outcome is of his trial and what we're gonna find out and what we're never gonna find out.

SPEAKER_00 27:55

I when I was reading through social media stuff, the stuff that really annoyed me was everybody chiming in. I guess it's just what a cesspool social media is sometimes, right? Particularly on a story like this, you just like you read through some of the comments and you get through about 15 of them, and you're just like you put the speed brakes on because there's just this consistent theme of stupidity, right? People are just like blaming the parents, you know. It's like, no. No. Like, look, you don't even know anything yet. I mean, everything is so sealed up tight that we don't even know all the facts, right? We're all we're all kind of just kind of collecting all this information almost through osmosis, but yet people are def yeah, yeah, no, I'm blaming the parents on this one.

SPEAKER_01 28:35

It's like, what I think um, I think that probably came about because of the oh, you knew he had mental problems, he's already in therapy. Why would you put them all together? Yeah, but yeah. I don't know.

SPEAKER_00 28:53

All of us have kids with all sorts of problems, right? I just I wouldn't be like, I'm not gonna put in my son and my daughter because they butt heads from time to time, and then suddenly they butt heads a little too hard and they're gonna blame me for no. I don't, I don't, I think it's kind of ridiculous to do that. But anyway, well, we're about out of time. We are maybe we could talk about this for a while. Actually, we've we'll come back to it because we're always gonna do updates, right? I mean right. We don't know if he's gonna be tried as an adult. If he is, that opens Pandora's box of this information. If he's not, then this goes down into the

What We May Never Learn

SPEAKER_00 29:30

abyss. Okay, for the next episode, we need to make an emergency turn of our ship towards sun and away from these clouds because we've done four, well, we're yeah, four episodes, and they increasingly are getting darker and darker, and it's dragging you and I down and down. So, what's your idea for turning this ship around?

SPEAKER_01 29:53

So, for episode five, um I want to talk about CSK, who we think it could be, um, how to keep people from getting murdered by CSK.

SPEAKER_00 30:07

Oh, so we can have fun with the concept of what if? Yes. What would you do? Yes, that's it. We've talked about that before over a pint or three, right? Yeah, we should take it.

SPEAKER_01 30:20

It could be it could be a lot of different people, and there's a lot of scenarios, how to keep safe.

SPEAKER_00 30:28

Yeah. So basically hypothesizing what if there is someone up there? How would and if you were there, what would you do? Yes. We're not the only ones that have thought about this.

SPEAKER_01 30:36

No, we're not. I I and if we are, we're sick. So I uh I was beginning to wonder about that, but no, there is some theories that there really is a crucial killer, although they they talk about that there could be several, not just one. But I I still think there's like a main one or two who've you know who've killed some people.

SPEAKER_00 30:58

Made a career out of it.

SPEAKER_01 30:59

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 31:00

All right, so next episode that's gonna be that'll be fun. All right. We'll just we'll just we'll just go on that. Okay, and see what happens. And then who knows? Episode six could just come offshoot from that. But I I still want to cover fights. There's some fights.

SPEAKER_01 31:13

Oh yeah, those are good. I I mean they're good, and you know, I I don't think anybody dies in the fights, but there's some there's some good fights.

SPEAKER_00 31:20

There's gotta be some great quotes, you know, great quotes from witnesses. Yeah, absolutely, and people that were throwing the punches. All right.

SPEAKER_01 31:29

Anchors away.

SPEAKER_00 31:30

Anchors away. That's it for this episode of Cruise Ship Killer. If you enjoyed the show, please subscribe, rate, and review, or don't. But statistically, the people who disappear never do either. Additional editing and sound design by Cal Deckhand. Sources for today's episode are linked in the show notes because shockingly, we did not make all of this up.

SPEAKER_01 32:05

This is a Kitty's Pub production.